PSIA Contemporary Ski Instruction

[epic]

I gave a ride home to a liftie tonight and he'd never heard of psia or aasi.

Was he Bulgarian?

[ToddW]

Was he Bulgarian?

No.  He was originally from BW's corner of PA.  He lives in Rutland now.

[epic]

No.  He was originally from BW's corner of PA.  He lives in Rutland now.

I love messing with the Bulgarian lifties. We used to have some Bulgarian instructors that taught me a teeny bit of Bulgarian. Those guys will drop their coffee when you greet them in their native tongue.

[bushwacka]

untill people realize that the PSIA is an organazation and not actually its instructors, I am done posting on this topic. Its does no one any good.

on me taking a lesson from harold harb thing. I am going to come out and say sure. Assuming its free. Remember I make about 20k a year and simply can not afford to take a lesson from him, and if I could take a lesson from him I would still spend the money on a sick ski trip.

So if someone wants to pay for my plane ticket to colorado, pay harold and and put me up in colorado then you can get your wish. Untill then its simply unaffordable to me. 

[jim-ratliff]

I'll start the drive with a $100 commitment to the "Send Bushwacka to Dumont" fund.

[jbotti]

I'll add another $100 nd if you are serious Bush, I would kick in more.

[ToddW]

I'll add another $100 nd if you are serious Bush, I would kick in more.

Ditto.  If you're serious, I'll help out if you're willing to do some study and homework before going.  I respect your passion for skiing, and exposure to HH might amp up your passion to new levels (it often has that effect.)

[midwif]

Okay, I'll bite.
I'm anteing $50 up front and another $50 if both are alive at 4pm.
Though i think a camp with video analysis etc, is the better choice than a one day lesson.
A five day  camp would yield a lot more info for each the others perspective.
L.

[epic]

With regards to the question of how many people have heard of PMTS. As many here know, Epicski.com banned mentioning PMTS a few years ago. My understanding is that Epic is run by PSIA members.

Does the PSIA (which has a monopolistic hold on ski instruction in the US) discourage its members from mentioning PMTS?

Just about every part of this quote is wrong (I am not going to discuss EpicSki moderation in any way shape or form though). But just what do you think that PSIA is? It's not a union (though many think that it should be) and most certainly is not a monopoly since as far as I know there are no ski schools at all that require membership in PSIA. As for discouraging mentioning PMTS, who would even do that? There is no thought police or union boss that follows us around to see what we are talking about.

[ToddW]

since as far as I know there are no ski schools at all that require membership in PSIA.

Aspen generally requires membership in PSIA or another country's ISIA affiliate.  And to a fair approximation requires PSIA level 3 or equivalent foreign cert (exception: a few new instructors they're grooming.)

[jbotti]

As for discouraging mentioning PMTS, who would even do that?

You can't be serious!! We don't have a lot of rules on this forum but some form of honesty is one of them. If you are en Epicski moderator you are being totally disingenous.

I could care less what you do or don't do on your forum, but you can't come over here and attempt to rewrite history!

[ToddW]

Central was early on the PMTS bandwagon.  A division officer and some examiners got into PMTS.  Looks like they slammed the barn doors shut after that. 

I understand the prohibition "during" events when they're acting as employees of PSIA-AASI Central.  The "before" and "after" prohibition seems a craven act.

[epic]

I'm still doing research but here is another example from PSIA Central Division. Notice how PMTS is the only listed competitor.

http://www.psia-c.org/forms/policiesProcedures.pdf

8.1. Non-Compete
Every PSIA-AASI Central member who serves on the Board, in the Office, on the Education Staff, or
other defined leadership role within the Division, while acting or appearing to act in such a role, must not
promote or support a PSIA-AASI Central competitor or that competitor's interests.

A PSIA-AASI Central competitor is a person or entity listed in this policy as conducting a business or
operation within the Central Division's geographic boundary or market area that is similar in nature to all
or part of the Central Division's operations of educating and certifying snowsports instructors. The Board
may amend this list at any time.

During, immediately before, or immediately after any PSIA-AASI Central event, members may not
certify instructors under a competitor's system, distribute a competitor's copyrighted materials, promote a
competitor's trademarked terms, or promote joining a competitor's organization.

List of PSIA-AASI Central competitors:
The Association of PMTS Direct Parallel? Instructors (PMTS)

Well that is interesting. I'm in Eastern, all I can tell you is I have never experienced anyone or anything of that nature.

btw - don't anyone get the idea that I am in love with PSIA or anything. I am decidedly not, but that's a whole 'nother thread.

[dan.boisvert]

And its not solely during events. Look at the following and consider the implications. Anyone in a leadership position is essentially forbidden from mentioning PMTS.

That's not true!  They can say all the bad stuff they want; they just can't "promote or support" it. 

More seriously, I think the politics in the east are different, and more attached to HH's name rather than "PMTS" as a system.  My understanding is that, when he left the area, he didn't do so in the most tactful of ways.  People here who like his stuff tend to be quiet about it (enthusiastic amateurs aside).

[jim-ratliff]

I would remind everyone that the most core requirement here is respect for the other members.
I was aware that Epic is an Epic moderator as is Phil.  That doesn't disqualify them from voicing their opinions any more than Max's role as the administrator on the PMTS forum disqualifies him. This forum is not a shill for PMTS, and the current combative tone is not welcome and not very respectful.

i have to assume that Epic is sharing knowledge as he knows it.  I find the accusation that he is striving to rewrite history totally inconsistent with my on-line perception of his personality.

So everyone, ease up a bit.

And forgive me for venting a little bit, but it is these types of pedagogical diatribes that have made discussion of PMTS unwelcome on other forums but wind up contributing nothing to real discourse. In fact, they do the exact opposite and eliminate the opportunity for the respective disciplines to discuss openly.  There is (and has been) bad blood between Harald and some of PSIA, but that is not a valid battle to be waging here.