Author Topic: Jim (a non-racer) and tubeless MTB tires  (Read 1645 times)

Svend

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Re: Jim (a non-racer) and tubeless MTB tires
« Reply #75 on: June 21, 2012, 09:31:32 pm »
Jim -- well done, and a good find.  Some very useful information in there.  Detailed and very thorough.  Thanks for posting that.  It is most helpful.

As a aside, I had a bit of "incentive" to go tubeless during a ride last evening.  My front tire developed a leak during a ride.  Nothing drastic - just noticed it was mushy on my way back to the truck after exiting the forest.  Must have hit a big root and had a small pinch flat.  Slapped the pump on the valve to get enough air in to get me the last 2 km, and promptly snapped the valve stem right off.  #&@%!!!  Said more blue words, and changed the tube.  This was my first pinch flat in 15 years.  Not impressed.  ::)   Can I blame it on the Kendas? Had I been running tubeless, this would not have happened.


jim-ratliff

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Re: Jim (a non-racer) and tubeless MTB tires
« Reply #76 on: June 22, 2012, 08:30:05 am »

You lucky dog!   ::)   At least your ride was almost over with.
Too bad you can't validate it as a pinch flat. Maybe the valve stem was failing/leaking before you put the pump on it.
Or maybe you just need to be a little bit more gentle with those Viking arms?
Fast'Air may have fixed it too.  I believe I read that it works in tubes or tires?
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bushwacka

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Re: Jim (a non-racer) and tubeless MTB tires
« Reply #77 on: June 22, 2012, 12:34:05 pm »
so let me get this straight Jim complained about how much full on UST weighs but now wants to run a tubeless system without sealant?

Which one is it Jim?
« Last Edit: June 22, 2012, 02:41:08 pm by jim-ratliff »

Svend

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Re: Jim (a non-racer) and tubeless MTB tires
« Reply #78 on: June 22, 2012, 01:16:08 pm »
You lucky dog!   ::)   At least your ride was almost over with.
Too bad you can't validate it as a pinch flat. Maybe the valve stem was failing/leaking before you put the pump on it.
Or maybe you just need to be a little bit more gentle with those Viking arms?
Fast'Air may have fixed it too.  I believe I read that it works in tubes or tires?

Yeah, I guess so.  But I was getting eaten by deer flies and huge mozzies, so was kind of distracted and rushed, swatting and swearing.  My wife standing there doing the same, saying "Hurry up! Aren't you done yet?" didn't help matters.  Next time I'll let the beasts get their pound of flesh and take it nice and gentle-like on the valve stem.   :D


jim-ratliff

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Re: Jim (a non-racer) and tubeless MTB tires
« Reply #79 on: June 22, 2012, 01:39:10 pm »
so let me get this straight Jim complained about how much full on UST weighs but now wants to run a tubeless system without sealant?

Which one is it Jim?


Both?   ;D   I don't know, but now both have become an option (again).  Before, I was feeling like tubeless still required the intelligent rider to add sealant, so tubeless was no better than "tubeless ready" (but I wasn't overly enamored of the hassle). But learning that "some people" ride with no sealant and have a good approach to fixing a flat quickly (with little likelihood of breaking the valve stem), then all of a sudden I'm rethinking.  Of course, you (Bushwacka) may wind up telling me that the "intelligent" rider does use sealant.   ;)
Epic's post describes an approach that is very appealing (and, honestly, more like tubeless on car tires). And not using an ammonia based product seems to be desirable.  The anecdote of the Fast'Air sealing the road tire for the duration of it's life was pretty surprising given the difference in air pressure required by the two types of tires. A good endorsement.
« Last Edit: June 22, 2012, 02:33:37 pm by jim-ratliff »
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jim-ratliff

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Re: Jim (a non-racer) and tubeless MTB tires
« Reply #80 on: June 22, 2012, 02:29:51 pm »
Jim,

I'm just curious -- have you ever actually had a flat on your mtn. bike? That is, in your antediluvian pre-tubeless days?  ;)  The reason I'm asking, is that you seem very concerned with flats and not having to fix them, hence one of the two main reasons for going tubeless.  I have been mtn. biking since 1989, very actively for the first 10 years, now back at it again after a hiatus. 

What I'm trying to say, is that your fear of pinch flats might be a bit overblown.  In other words, don't worry so much, and just go riding. 


The likelihood may be overblown, but as you said today, the physical PITA factor is still fresh in my memory. I've had a couple of road bike walks as well, once for a flat and another a broken derailleur but those didn't stick with me the way the flat out in the sticks did. In fact, for the derailleur I called a taxi for a ride home.
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epic

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Re: Jim (a non-racer) and tubeless MTB tires
« Reply #81 on: July 15, 2012, 04:28:16 pm »
Hey guys, I rode my first Stan's setup today on a demo bike. I didn't really know quite what it was when I got on it. It was inflated to a normal for me 30 psi. The rims were DT-Swiss and tires were Maxxis Minion DHFs. The tires/wheels rode fine up the climb, but could have used a bit more air since the sidewalls are thinner than a typical UST sidewall. I could occasionally feel the rim bounce off the ground. At that point I thought there were tubes in there as the Stan's valve doesn't have the telltale nut of a UST valve. What really gave it away for me was on the very first turn (for Bushwacker, this was the first spine on the top of Spear) of the downhill where it made a huge racket and the tire had the biggest burp I've ever experienced. There was a ring of dried Stan's hanging from about 150 degrees of the tires bead. This is where I feel that the ghetto solutions are a fail relative to true tubeless setups. IMHO you need to have that dedicated tubeless interface between tire and rim. On the plus side, the wheel did reseal itself at once without too much loss of air for me to continue. I kept rimming the wheels when I hit stuff, and I  had to slow down for corners, but I could still ride pretty fast as long as I made sure that things were hitting the back wheel dead-on. They felt pretty bad on sidehills though even before the burp, you could feel it trying to roll. About halfway down, I caught up with some Quebecois guys and borrowed their pump (it even had a gauge) re-inflated to 35 psi and continued with no further problems. At 35 psi though, I felt that a lot of the advantage of tubeless was negated. It was bouncier for sure.

bushwacka

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Re: Jim (a non-racer) and tubeless MTB tires
« Reply #82 on: July 15, 2012, 06:14:26 pm »
stans rim(which seams to be working) or stans rim strips(which I loath and think should die)

jim-ratliff

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Re: Jim (a non-racer) and tubeless MTB tires
« Reply #83 on: July 15, 2012, 07:26:30 pm »
DT Swiss rims, so must be Stan's rim strips. From what I've read, burping that bad is the result of the wrong rim strips or not enough layers or rim to rim coverage.  My take is that Stan's relies on the strips under the bead to wedge the tire bead against the clincher part of the wheel.

So we all agree on the importance of the bead/wheel interface? That is the crux of all of the "tubeless ready" products that may not be leak proof or be UST certified, but do have the UST bead design.


Bushwacka, would you say that the ghetto tubeless works better than Stan's rim strips??
« Last Edit: July 16, 2012, 09:11:07 am by jim-ratliff »
"If you're gonna play the game boy, ya gotta learn to play it right."