Author Topic: Ski Jacket Recommendations  (Read 4068 times)

jbotti

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Re: Ski Jacket Recommendations
« Reply #15 on: October 30, 2011, 05:52:29 pm »
I am convinced that gear from quality manufacturers is comparable. I have looked closely at Kjus and Mountain Force jackets (both priced in the stratosphere) and I am convinced that my Marker Gore tex performance shell insulated jacket has essentially the same materials (except for Gore Tex which may be preferable to their (Kjus and MF) waterproof shell material) to what is in the Kjus and MF jackets. I really only shop 4 things anymore, Features (pit zips, powder skirt, enough pockets), Waterproof (some form of truly waterproof material)  fit which for me especially with pants can be hard (whenever I find a pair of pnats that is small enough in the waist and long enough in the legs I usually buy two pairs) and lastly and perhaps most important;y: Color (and/or style)!!. As for durability, most people wear a jacket or pants for 3-5 seasons before they decide to get something new (and for me pants age faster than Jackets). Most skiers do not wear out their outerwear, and all the major brands hold up well for that amount of time especially if you wash them with Nik wax and apply more DWR after several washings.

I guess because I ski mostly in Montana versus Tahoe in the past, I also prefer puffy's/insulated jackets (Pataonia Primo Down Jacket is my favorite and an awesome product!!). I try to wear as little as possible underneath (usually a long sleeve thin shirt and a Nano puff jacket (great Patagonia product as well) or a light smartwool layer and this allows me to cool down quicly on the lift if I find myself sweating. The whole layering thing with a shell never really worked for me. I was never as warm when I was moving slowly as I am with an insulated jacket, and I when I got hot it was really hard to open things up to get in cold air quickly. An insualted jacket with Pit Zips is awesome for MT, I can cool down in 2-3 minutes on the lift and then zip things back up and be warm when I get off. IMO, for resort skiing this is a vastly superior set up.

Gary

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Re: Ski Jacket Recommendations
« Reply #16 on: October 31, 2011, 08:12:03 am »
I agree with JB on similar things I also look for in a ski jacket.

I have however had to replace jackets after 2 or 3 season...(60 plus or minus days out each season) because of grease stains from cranky lifts or pilling or wear spots where my arms seem to brush against the jacket...really fries my azz because it shouldn't do that.. THe biggest buggaboo is the stains that no matter how I treat or what I do seem to go deep and don't retreat.

As for the different brands...many of the products in the upper range you are looking for truly are top notch gear...color, features and fit are probably going to be the "decider's" for you.


jbotti

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Re: Ski Jacket Recommendations
« Reply #17 on: October 31, 2011, 08:16:41 am »
Yes stains and Gore Tex are not a good match!!

Gary

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Re: Ski Jacket Recommendations
« Reply #18 on: October 31, 2011, 08:28:25 am »
You know I wish there was some common denominator when it comes to waterproofing when describing the materials use to achieve the ratings.

EX: my new Spyder jacket for waterproofing uses the following: XT.L Laminate and Spylon DWR..what the heck?

I was able to find out that the Spylon was a spray on material...the rest is a mystery to me.

Hopefully, it all works.

Gary

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Re: Ski Jacket Recommendations
« Reply #19 on: October 31, 2011, 09:53:34 am »
Thanks again Max...great explanation...

I think along with the waterproofing...bre athability is a HUGE factor...gotta breath or moisture build up is a REAL prob!

Now for those miserable rain days where I'm loving the snow but sitting on very wet chairs...out comes the neoprene "bun" protector...that truly works looks dorky...but hey...dry biscits is dry biscits!   :o

Best, G

jbotti

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Re: Ski Jacket Recommendations
« Reply #20 on: October 31, 2011, 01:11:41 pm »
I personaly think breathability is way overrated for resort skiing. Where I find breathability to be very important is for back country skiing especially when you are skinning and hiking. Here you are working for your turns and generating a lot of body heat when you aren't skiing (which is most of the time unfortunately) and having a shell that breathes and the ability to add and take off layers is essential. For resort skiing I find that having pits zips is all that I need especially if I have an insulated jacket and wear minmal layers. I do find this to be vastly superior to shells with many layers again for lift access skiing where you are seated on fast (or slow) moving lifts between runs.

jim-ratliff

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Re: Ski Jacket Recommendations
« Reply #21 on: October 31, 2011, 01:40:34 pm »



$.06 worth. I have one jacket (maybe the Columbia) which has vents in front of the pits rather than under.  Much easier to get the zipper up and down, much less bulk under the arms, and can actually get ventilation in the chair lift where you normally have your arms pretty close to your sides. And better ventilation when skiing, as well, since the speed of skiing forces ventilation.


As a general statement, I have found these far superior to arm pit "pit zips".
"If you're gonna play the game boy, ya gotta learn to play it right."

Gary

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Re: Ski Jacket Recommendations
« Reply #22 on: October 31, 2011, 01:50:31 pm »
Max great link....splains a bunch!  Thanks.

JB...I'm just saying for me...if I"m out making tons of turns 4-5 hours on the snow....groomers, pow, bumps, crud or whatever....I"m working up a good sweat..with good silk base layer and wick away layer above that..it moves that moisture away from my skin but I find it's got to have somewhere to go....underarmvents certainly help a great deal...but..

I find that gear that breaths is critical...especial ly at 15 deg f and colder when opening up the jackets just creates a body chill. I have always used front and underarm vents to help mitigate overheating...will be curious to see if the higher breathablity feature really pays off.

Jim...interesting 6 cents cause its the first time I've had those kind of vents on any jacket I've owned...(vents in front) are on my new Spyder....glad to hear they work well.
G


jbotti

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Re: Ski Jacket Recommendations
« Reply #23 on: October 31, 2011, 02:02:11 pm »
Gary, for two months straight in MT it rarely gets above 15F. Maybe the dfference is that I don't sweat that often. When I do I find it better to have less layers, regulate it with the pit zips and open up on the lift when I am hot. Yes a wicking base layer is essential.

jbotti

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Re: Ski Jacket Recommendations
« Reply #24 on: October 31, 2011, 09:34:33 pm »
I found this post from Ron on Epicski. This material (DryQ Elite) looks quite interesting and it ups the ante in the waterproof breathable space. It appears to double the breathability numbers versus Gore Tex so for those that want and need this, DryQ should be included in the mix. My guess is that others will follow with similar breakthroughs.

Ron's jacket selection looks pretty nice as well. It's a true softshell that is totally waterproof and very breathable. The downside is that it won't be windproof. Should be great for truly active activities or for those that sweat a lot when they ski.

Here is the link to Ron's commentary:

http://www.epicski.com/t/106336/mountain-hardwear-kepler-softshell-jacket

The gloves he talks about may be even more interesting for me. My biggest problem with gloves is having my hands sweat and the only time my hands get cold is when I have sweated up the inside of the glove and it gets wet. My solution for years has been to take them off on the lifts whichlps cool down my hands and prevents moisture buildup. These gloves may be perfect for me with greater breathability.

Here is the link:

http://www.epicski.com/t/106345/mountain-hardwear-bazuka-gloves-and-other-outdry-gloves-a-true-h20-proof-glove

After seeing this I reda up on DryQ and reda some reviews of the technology from some alpine climbing sites. Looks like the stuff is quite good and a true step forward. 

Both seem like real interesting products with some potentially gamechanging technology. Thanks Ron, even though you've abandoned us and your buddy Phil disses us!


Liam

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Re: Ski Jacket Recommendations
« Reply #25 on: November 01, 2011, 05:52:46 am »
As to wet butts from  sitting on snow and sometimes rain ( :'() covered lift chairs....

Myself and a number of other patrollers use those Neoprene 'Hot Buns".  Basically a fairly substantial neoprene layer with velcro straps that covers your butt and your back thighs.  They work pretty well and cost about 20 bucks.  They make 12 hour wet days a lot more enjoyable...I have goretex pro-shell pants that will wet out on a wet day of lift riding, these make a huge difference.  Yep, they are a little dorky...but what's cooler than staying dry and warm?

You can find them on line...but be prepared for a lot of unintended hits if you type 'Hot Buns' in your google search engine! :D

Gary

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Re: Ski Jacket Recommendations
« Reply #26 on: November 01, 2011, 08:12:51 am »
Ron does his homework on gear....for sure....and where he decides to make time to post...certainly his call. His equipment and gear exposure and sharing that info I must admit is missed here...but hey...saylavee!

He and I were chating a month ago about gloves for the very reason JB pointed out...breathability .

It's so funny, my bag has 4 pairs of gloves...for 4 different types of weather conditions.

Ron's my go to test support guy on many things and I'm waiting to hear his review of those gloves on mountain. I'd love to be able to pair down my glove addiction to maybe 2 pair.

As far as any disses....who cares...people who know us like us or NOT....my attitiude...who give a sheazit!

G

LivingProof

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Re: Ski Jacket Recommendations
« Reply #27 on: November 01, 2011, 08:41:31 am »

The gloves he talks about may be even more interesting for me. My biggest problem with gloves is having my hands sweat and the only time my hands get cold is when I have sweated up the inside of the glove and it gets wet. My solution for years has been to take them off on the lifts whichlps cool down my hands and prevents moisture buildup. These gloves may be perfect for me with greater breathability.

After seeing this I reda up on DryQ and reda some reviews of the technology from some alpine climbing sites. Looks like the stuff is quite good and a true step forward. 



John,

I bought the next model down the MH line, called the "Medusa". On Altrec they have same '10 leftovers for $115 (mine were $90). No XL's left, as I have long thin fingers, I need the length. No real change in this years model, just more $$ to buy. My concern is how much will the palm and finger bottom's breath as there is leather on the exterior of the glove. Some reviews found them "cold" and that may indicate superior breathing. Mine have removable liners...I like the ability to change liners during the day, or, just do without on warmer days.
All I know is that I skied with ToddW in the rain at K'ton last year and there was water trapped inside my old gloves making it very uncomfortable.

What do you use in Montana on very cold days?



jbotti

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Re: Ski Jacket Recommendations
« Reply #28 on: November 01, 2011, 10:38:53 am »
LP, I have been using the Hestra Alpine Pro Heli Glove as well (mine have Gore Tex XCR). Great gloves and they keep my hands very warm. I probably don't need that much warmth. I have the mittens as well but even on days when the temps are below 0* F I still wear the gloves otherwise my hands sweat way to much.  I may check out a pair of the MH gloves you mentioned.

smackboy1

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Re: Ski Jacket Recommendations
« Reply #29 on: November 02, 2011, 07:45:33 am »
The gloves he talks about may be even more interesting for me. My biggest problem with gloves is having my hands sweat and the only time my hands get cold is when I have sweated up the inside of the glove and it gets wet. My solution for years has been to take them off on the lifts whichlps cool down my hands and prevents moisture buildup. These gloves may be perfect for me with greater breathability.

+1

This is exactly my problem too. I sweat  a lot, especially my hands. Not surprisingly my kids have inherited the sweaty gene. Hands get cold and then the whining begins  :(

This DryQ Elite/OutDry might be worth the extra $ for me. Is Mountain Hardware/Coumbia the only mfr which has these improved fabrics or do others have them too under their own proprietary name?
« Last Edit: November 02, 2011, 08:08:57 am by smackboy1 »
I'm not a ski instructor, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.